LONGINES "Greenlander" - Fact or Fiction? - The Military Watch Resource

Hal-in-London · 02-13-2008, 17:06

My good friend Chris Balm (see his web site www.cjbalm.com) recently had the following email sent to him from Lt.Richard Brett-Knowles formerly of the British Royal Navy and a member of the Greenland Expedition 52-54.

I have the permission of both Chris and Richard to post this info here as I am sure you will all find it interesting.

Dear Chris

I note from your website that you have sold a Longines 'Greenlander' watch
as being used by the British North Greenland Expedition 1952-54. As a
member of this Expedition, I can reliably inform you that no Longines
watches were worn by anyone on the British North Greenland Expedition
1952-1954.

Chronometers and chronometer watches were loaned by the Navy and
wristwatches by Rolex and I wore my Lemania Navy Pilots' Watch and my
chronometer watch was loaned by Vacheron et Constantin.

I trust this information will be of assistance to you in future.

Regards

Richard Brett-Knowles

James D · 02-13-2008, 17:27

I´ve heard the Longines WWW sometimes referred to as a Greenlander. And that certainly pre-dates and 1952 expedition.

Joe A. · 02-13-2008, 18:10

Well so much for the action packed background for the photos I took...Joe A.

Rafael_T · 02-13-2008, 18:16

One myth debunked?

Joe A. · 02-13-2008, 19:04

It would appear that way...

Bretta · 02-13-2008, 19:14

I can't remember the details or find any reference but I'm sure the whole "Greenlander" thing came about because the WWW Longines was wrongly referred to in an Italian military watch book as having been used in the Greenland expeditions and has been wrongly referred to ever since.

I'm sure someone else here will have the exact details.

regards
Bretta

Joe A. · 02-13-2008, 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bretta

I can't remember the details or find any reference but I'm sure the whole "Greenlander" thing came about because the WWW Longines was wrongly referred to in an Italian military watch book as having been used in the Greenland expeditions and has been wrongly referred to ever since.

I'm sure someone else here will have the exact details.

regards
Bretta

Bretta, Now that I recall, that's where I heard it came from too! Joe A.

Jon · 02-14-2008, 02:33

Although it may not have been used in the Greenland Expedition, Ziggy once said that he was aware that there was some post WW2 activity involving the British in the Antarctic and I'm pretty sure that he said that these watches were issued for these problems and for cold weather.

In the day, Longines was known to be a reliable timepiece maker for exploration. I'll dig out my Whitney's tonight, but I remember that in his chapter about Longines, he mentioned that they made timepieces that were known to be reliable in hard conditions and favored for exploration.

Longines may have made itself a "department store" watch until just recently. But in earlier times they were the choice for aviators and explorers.

Bill58 · 02-14-2008, 04:35

That's a real treasure--I wish I had one.

Bretta · 02-14-2008, 10:18

Yep, I'm quite happy to keep calling mine a Greenlander too.

polo2 · 02-14-2008, 12:21

thanks for the info, nice watches pals

the story is like the steeve mcqueen explorer or cousteau's blancpain.
uncorrectly known as.... but the names will stay

martin · 02-15-2008, 00:01

Just put Greenlander in quotes. Longines "Greenlander"...

Hal-in-London · 02-15-2008, 10:20

A ROLEX "Greenlander".

Hal-in-London · 02-15-2008, 10:20

A ROLEX "Greenlander".

Hal-in-London · 02-15-2008, 10:20

A ROLEX "Greenlander".

Hal-in-London · 02-15-2008, 10:26

It looks as if I would like 3 of them!!!

Paul_in_Perth · 02-15-2008, 12:59

Can be seen in an old RAF film that covers the retrieval of the expedition party. He is wearing two white dialed watches one quite obviously a chronograph. The film is titled Operation Icelift and I believe it is on a DVD compilation entitled RAF Unseen films although I found it via a torrent download

Rrryan · 02-15-2008, 14:36

Thought that had long been established, or at least it had been in my mind, that the Longines was "just" a WWW with little chance of Greenland pedigree. The Italians IIRC have also been blamed for erroneous "Steve McQueen" monikers here and there as well.

Still quite nice, and I'm sure many in the know will still continue to refer to them as "Greenlander" out of simple convention if nothing else, much like plenty still call vintage Omega movements "red gold" even though it's widely known that they have no gold content.

VC's in Greenland though are something of a surprise, though they had made ships' and survey chonometers before, so why not?

Hal-in-London · 02-15-2008, 15:14

I am so pleased I posted this.

Joe A. · 02-16-2008, 01:56

Soooo Hal, do you own a "Greenlander?"

02-13-2008, 17:06	#1
Hal-in-London Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 100	LONGINES "Greenlander" - Fact or Fiction? My good friend Chris Balm (see his web site www.cjbalm.com) recently had the following email sent to him from Lt.Richard Brett-Knowles formerly of the British Royal Navy and a member of the Greenland Expedition 52-54. I have the permission of both Chris and Richard to post this info here as I am sure you will all find it interesting. Dear Chris I note from your website that you have sold a Longines 'Greenlander' watch as being used by the British North Greenland Expedition 1952-54. As a member of this Expedition, I can reliably inform you that no Longines watches were worn by anyone on the British North Greenland Expedition 1952-1954. Chronometers and chronometer watches were loaned by the Navy and wristwatches by Rolex and I wore my Lemania Navy Pilots' Watch and my chronometer watch was loaned by Vacheron et Constantin. I trust this information will be of assistance to you in future. Regards Richard Brett-Knowles

02-13-2008, 18:10	#3
Joe A. Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 379	What do we call 'em know? Well so much for the action packed background for the photos I took...Joe A.

02-13-2008, 18:16	#4
Rafael_T Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,007	And a thousand, well maybe a few dozen, hearts skipped a beat... One myth debunked?

02-13-2008, 19:04	#5
Joe A. Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 379	I've heard rumblings over the years that the nomiker was not accurate It would appear that way...

02-14-2008, 02:33	#8
Jon Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: New Zealand Posts: 364	Yep.....but I'm still calling mine a Greenlander. Although it may not have been used in the Greenland Expedition, Ziggy once said that he was aware that there was some post WW2 activity involving the British in the Antarctic and I'm pretty sure that he said that these watches were issued for these problems and for cold weather. In the day, Longines was known to be a reliable timepiece maker for exploration. I'll dig out my Whitney's tonight, but I remember that in his chapter about Longines, he mentioned that they made timepieces that were known to be reliable in hard conditions and favored for exploration. Longines may have made itself a "department store" watch until just recently. But in earlier times they were the choice for aviators and explorers.

02-13-2008, 17:27	#2
James D Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 108	I´ve heard the Longines WWW sometimes referred to as a Greenlander. And that certainly pre-dates and 1952 expedition.

02-13-2008, 19:14	#6
Bretta Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: ---- Posts: 179	I can't remember the details or find any reference but I'm sure the whole "Greenlander" thing came about because the WWW Longines was wrongly referred to in an Italian military watch book as having been used in the Greenland expeditions and has been wrongly referred to ever since. I'm sure someone else here will have the exact details. regards Bretta

02-14-2008, 04:35	#9
Bill58 Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: So. Korea Posts: 597	That's a real treasure--I wish I had one.

02-14-2008, 10:18	#10
Bretta Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: ---- Posts: 179	Yep, I'm quite happy to keep calling mine a Greenlander too.

02-14-2008, 12:21	#11
polo2 Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: montpellier france Posts: 324	thanks for the info, nice watches pals the story is like the steeve mcqueen explorer or cousteau's blancpain. uncorrectly known as.... but the names will stay

02-15-2008, 00:01	#12
martin Moderator Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,581	Just put Greenlander in quotes. Longines "Greenlander"...

02-15-2008, 10:20	#13
Hal-in-London Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 100	I wish I had >> A ROLEX "Greenlander".

02-15-2008, 10:26	#16
Hal-in-London Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 100	Sorry > It looks as if I would like 3 of them!!!

02-15-2008, 12:59	#17
Paul_in_Perth Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 22	Richard Brett-Knowles Can be seen in an old RAF film that covers the retrieval of the expedition party. He is wearing two white dialed watches one quite obviously a chronograph. The film is titled Operation Icelift and I believe it is on a DVD compilation entitled RAF Unseen films although I found it via a torrent download

02-15-2008, 14:36	#18
Rrryan Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: USA Posts: 940	Thought it was old news too Thought that had long been established, or at least it had been in my mind, that the Longines was "just" a WWW with little chance of Greenland pedigree. The Italians IIRC have also been blamed for erroneous "Steve McQueen" monikers here and there as well. Still quite nice, and I'm sure many in the know will still continue to refer to them as "Greenlander" out of simple convention if nothing else, much like plenty still call vintage Omega movements "red gold" even though it's widely known that they have no gold content. VC's in Greenland though are something of a surprise, though they had made ships' and survey chonometers before, so why not? __________________ I Already Have a Watch

02-15-2008, 15:14	#19
Hal-in-London Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 100	Fantastic replies >> I am so pleased I posted this.

02-16-2008, 01:56	#20
Joe A. Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 379	Query for Hal Soooo Hal, do you own a "Greenlander?"

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