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Thread: Smiths Mk X just sold on ebay . . . .

  1. #121

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    Quote Originally Posted by Revo View Post
    Interesting to see that the hole for the friction spring (in the top plate by the balance cock) seems to drilled all the way through on the striped one but only part way through (i.e. as a recess) on the plain one; also the plain one has two sets of teeth on the mainspring barrel.

    Any thoughts or ideas?
    The hole for the spring is all the way through and is threaded on the plain movement, it is just the angle the photo was taken.
    Also the other movement will have the same arrangement in the barrel area I believe that the mainspring barrel on the one with stripes is just not visible due to shadow.

  2. #122
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    Hi Revo
    When I am next in my work shop of the 4 mk x / 1315 movements that I have I compare the size of the rachet wheel to see if there a difference
    Tudor

  3. #123
    Senior Member isologue's Avatar
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    Re: restored pics of 6B/300 re-marked watch.

    Thanks for doing that, Dave. A valuable record of the first Mark X spotted in the wild (retrospectively).

    Regards,

    Martin (isologue)

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tudor View Post
    Hi Barry
    The ⌚ case for the smiths 6b159 & 6b 300 & mk x also any smiths 1315 movement is the same
    It was made by Dennisson watch case company case pattern number on my 3 are the same
    PATTERN NO 13322
    Only smiths 1315 movement will fit this case the lip on the movement fits in to a recess in the case
    I also have a Dennisson case with pattern no
    13322 with a omega cal 268 but the cases are different this case has no recess to take a movement with a lip on it

    This is my research
    So l assert my copyrights

    Copyright Owen Gilchrist
    Would it be the case then ('scuse the pun) that Smiths 're-machined' the mid case of the stock Dennison 13322 to form the lip for the 13 ligne mvt and then fitted a larger mvt ring to take up the slack? Or do you think Dennison supplied the case as is, as a modified prototype, based on their popular case (it is quite early in the run of the 13322 isn't it?) Could be confusing at Dennison to have two different cases with the same design code.

  5. #125

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tudor View Post
    Hi Barry
    The ⌚ case for the smiths 6b159 & 6b 300 & mk x also any smiths 1315 movement is the same
    It was made by Dennisson watch case company case pattern number on my 3 are the same
    PATTERN NO 13322
    Only smiths 1315 movement will fit this case the lip on the movement fits in to a recess in the case
    I also have a Dennisson case with pattern no
    13322 with a omega cal 268 but the cases are different this case has no recess to take a movement with a lip on it
    This is my research
    So l assert my copyrights
    Copyright Owen Gilchrist
    The big question which bugs me is that 'with the war on' Dennison would have made a standard GSTP case into which could be fitted a 'standard' 6B.159 movement from Omega or A N Other. That the 13322 case is rebated to receive a 13-ligne Smiths reinforces my view Smiths modified an exsiting 6B.159 case!

    The MoS/MAP would hardly sanction a new unique Dennison case for a prototype watch, but would tool up for a volume order 6B.300 Mk.X in 1944... which they did!

    The next question is why a 13-ligne flanged 12-ligne movement? I'm pretty sure this was developed as a 'universal fit, war-time utility replacement'... after all Smiths was a major government service/repair contractor! I could be wrong :-)

    Bags I first dibs at one of your refurbished Mk.Xs, please Owen?!!

  6. #126
    Super Moderator dave's Avatar
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    has anyone got a note of the blurry case serial number of this first Mark X,

    I thought that I had recorded it in the original thread but alas I've lost it..

  7. #127
    Super Moderator dave's Avatar
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    another question for Barry - geneva stripes on wartime watches?

  8. #128
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    Barry we were both drinking Darjeeling at the same time!! You make the point with much more detail. Thank you.

  9. #129
    Super Moderator dave's Avatar
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    I was drinking nespresso..

  10. #130
    Senior Member isologue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave View Post
    has anyone got a note of the blurry case serial number of this first Mark X,

    I thought that I had recorded it in the original thread but alas I've lost it..
    It sold for GBP 147 in 2011, I note. (Those were the days; the world's gone mad, etc etc). The description read:

    Vintage military watch with soldered strap lugs and military engraving on rear of case.

    engraving reads: A.M. 6B 159 (crossed out) with 300 engraved below, then in smaller numerals: 12253/42.

    Nice brown leather strap is sewn onto the soldered posts!

    Case Measures 33.5mm diameter without crown and 10.5mm depth.

    Watch runs but not reliably so and has not been further tested, I am not a watch repairer so cannot provide more info.


    please consider the very least this watch will need is a full service!!

    sold as is with a low starting bid,


    I'm not sure we had a Dennison case serial but they're pretty unstructured anyway.

    Regards,

    Martin (isologue)

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave View Post
    I was drinking nespresso..
    Dave.....Nespresso?!?! that's a bit George Clooney! Speaking of which, and wartime austerity, isn't it the case sometimes in those periods that we see 'inappropriate' amounts of money spent on odd (pet) projects by the military. Have you seen the film 'The Men Who Stare at Goats', starring G. Clooney....

  12. #132
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    Hi Barry
    Dennisson ⌚ case pattern no 13322 is stamp on my omega case back and my smiths 1315 case back but they are different diameters
    There is no case ring on the 1315 cases
    There is no proof (l have to my friend Philip priestly on this in great detail)
    But l believe Dennisson made this case to fit only smiths 1315 /6b-159 /6b-300 movements
    Owen

  13. #133

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    I don't doubt your comments, Owen, but is the diameter difference in the overall outer or the internal bore: ie 12 or 13 linge? Can we have the measurements/photo? I presume 13322 is thus a style offered in various lignes?

    nespresseo vs Darjeeling? No contest! Darjeeling (stirred not shaken) every time! Someone has to set standards!!

    Geneve stripe in wartime? In theory 'no' as all war time production was (generally) to war-utility spec under MoS or MAP orders and only exports in the early-war and immediate postwar would normally be allow 'superfluous/trivial commercial decoration'... so it possible there do exist some legitimate war-time examples/test pieces... Anyone know a good clairvoyant?

  14. #134

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    Just been sent photos of this mark X by another eBay member who has noticed my watch, he has owned this watch for a couple of years, the case back is a replacement, funnily enough his case screw is broken too.




  15. #135
    Super Moderator dave's Avatar
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    click the image and then click Download original image twice.


    the inner part of the rear flange appears completely different.

    that style of seconds hand has also been noted previously on one of these.

    also Simon's watch has the very same screw missing as well.

  16. #136
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    Hi martin
    On the 12.02.2012 on this forum I printed out pictures of you mk x

    The case body picture is a bit blurred but I think the Dennisson case serial number is
    2972
    Owen

  17. #137
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    Hi Dave
    As you quoted the flange inner is different

    It has been milled in wards to create a lower lip to enable the 2case screws to be lower than the snap allowing clearance between the movement and case back
    Owen

  18. #138
    Senior Member isologue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tudor View Post
    Hi martin
    On the 12.02.2012 on this forum I printed out pictures of you mk x

    The case body picture is a bit blurred but I think the Dennisson case serial number is
    2972
    Owen
    Hello Owen,

    The original 6B/300 is not mine unfortunately. A few of us were lurking around it at the time but nobody understood the peculiar designation until Ken G dug out the documentation a little while later....

    My example (gilt finished, Geneva stripes) has a 13322 Dennison case number of 3632. Strangely, this number is stamped to the inner ring of the mid case, like 3621 in the example presented by Michael E above, rather than to the lug area. (I've only just noticed that). It has been suggested that gilt movements are used for bench testing for some reason: have you heard of that practice? (Again, mine is the only gilt finished Mark X movement I have seen, off the top of my head).

    Regards,

    Martin (isologue)

  19. #139
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    Thought I should add mine, all images disappeared due to bloody Photobucket, but all sorted now. Hope these add something
    Simon




  20. #140
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    Apologies if this is boring to you more experienced watch folk but just to get this clear in my mind as obviously I haven't seen one of these in person....the 13322 case is used for the 30mm (13 ligne) Omega mvt and the Smiths 1315 mvt with the 13 ligne rim but 12 ligne mvt (and others). Visible on the 13322 cases of the Mk X illustrated so far is what appears to be a case mod in a different coloured metal to form a lip for the 13 ligne flange and tighten up the rest of the mid case for the 12 ligne mvt. This 'case mod' sometimes having the Dennison numbers stamped on it (see Isologue's post above), as is there practice on the 3 piece cases, is very strong evidence that Dennison manufactured the cases specifically for the Smiths Mark X and 1315 mvt watches?

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