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Thread: WW2 Seikosha "Suirobu" Chronograph IJN

  1. #21
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    This one easier to see dial than your photo.

  2. #22
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    More Seikosha - Longines.




    Lumen dial


  3. #23
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    Non-military Longines 18.72 pocket watches for comparisons. I have these handsets by the way.
    Possibly, Hattori Tokei only cased the watches. Looks like dial, hands, and movement could have been
    supplied to Hattori Tokei ready to case. Note: military dials do not say Longines.




    May have to look at the dial to avoid fakes.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Joe A.'s Avatar
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    Seiji, This is a very informative thread. I went through a "Japanese phase," picking up several of these time pieces. Here is the last one I picked up.

     photo DSCF0001_zpsa9730d08.jpg
    Seikosha Chronometer Maizura Kyoto Naval Base photo DSCF0008_zpsece00c0c.jpg

  5. #25
    Senior Member Joe A.'s Avatar
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    Another...
     photo SeikosahPhonotelemeterIII.jpg
     photo SeikoshaPhonotelemeterI.jpg
     photo SeikoshaPhonotelemeterII.jpg

  6. #26
    Senior Member Joe A.'s Avatar
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    A vet bring back...
     photo seikosha1.jpg
     photo seikosha3.jpg
     photo seikosha6.jpg

  7. #27
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe A. View Post
    A vet bring back...
     photo seikosha1.jpg
     photo seikosha3.jpg
     photo seikosha6.jpg
    Joe: These are fine examples. From what I know, these are completely untouched originals.
    However, I am wondering about the minute hand on the second style case.
    I find the style 2 case interesting, it has an early style dial, but the case also has the earlier
    style kanji writing for the numbers. I have to re-think which order the cases were produced.
    I assumed that the style 1 case came first since it was copied from the Minerva watch. I assumed
    the second style case came later as an improvement. It looks more durable.


    The Phonotelemeter, does it have any writing on the case back?

  8. #28
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    Good news, got a positive reply from Longines Museum about my Seikosha - Longines.


  9. #29
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    To clear up some confusion and seen several questions about these. These are government railroad watches. Many variations
    on the caseback markings. Can't list all the possible variations.





  10. #30
    Senior Member papazulu's Avatar
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    The info I got from a Japanese Forum (in Japan) was that the Kanji meant "Heavy Iron" which would of course mean Railroad/Railway

    Here mine



    Jimmy
    Don't talk to me about naval tradition. It's nothing but rum, sodomy and the lash.
    Sir Winston Churchill

  11. #31
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by papazulu View Post
    The info I got from a Japanese Forum (in Japan) was that the Kanji meant "Heavy Iron" which would of course mean Railroad/Railway

    Here mine



    Jimmy
    Very Interesting watch. Note: I don't think that is Japanese. Taiwanese? That Kanji (Japanese Chinese) character looks more like Hanzi (Tradtional Chinese as opposed to Mandarin Chinese characters ) to me.

  12. #32
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    Sorry it shrunk. Photobucket bug. Below was interesting pages on
    http://www.kodokei.com/pw_024_1.html




  13. #33
    Moderator Syrte's Avatar
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    can't believe all the pics are gone on this thread. What a pity. What's going on?

  14. #34
    Moderator lambstew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syrte View Post
    can't believe all the pics are gone on this thread. What a pity. What's going on?
    Sylvie - If you aren't aware, Photobucket now charges for third party image hosting and blocks previously hosted images if you haven't upgraded which is what happened with the pics.. Imgur is an excellent alternative see discussion here: http://www.mwrforum.net/forums/showt...-hosting-sites

  15. #35
    Moderator Syrte's Avatar
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    Thanks Konrad, I didn't realize as I had indeed upgraded just a tad. Can't believe all these pics are lost for public viewing.

  16. #36
    Moderator lambstew's Avatar
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    Now it's going to be like cleaning up a battlefield of dead links after a massacre.. I guess all that can be done is for OP's to consider re-populating older posts such as this one using a new host such as Imgur..

    It's terrible the way they handled this considering the widespread negative impact on so many other sites..It's like blackmail the way they quietly introduced the new fee and hold your images hostage unless you agree to pay the $400/yr ransom..they could have given us a grace period considering the fallout..

  17. #37
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syrte View Post
    Thanks Konrad, I didn't realize as I had indeed upgraded just a tad. Can't believe all these pics are lost for public viewing.

    Hi Syrte, I will make time when I have less to do and fix this or make an updated thread on Karafu watches. If some French forum guy wants to take my material and re-publish material it as if it is his discovery, well the Internet is the Wild West and it's gonna be pretty hard to do anything about it. It's too bad, I can't say I haven't paraphrased some information I have read so I am not entirely innocent myself. But, at least I try to link where I got the info Someone did that with my 13e RDP information as well and was damn proud of it as well. Eventually someone relinks the original so maybe justice finds its way.

  18. #38
    Moderator Syrte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambstew View Post
    Now it's going to be like cleaning up a battlefield of dead links after a massacre.. I guess all that can be done is for OP's to consider re-populating older posts such as this one using a new host such as Imgur..

    It's terrible the way they handled this considering the widespread negative impact on so many other sites..It's like blackmail the way they quietly introduced the new fee and hold your images hostage unless you agree to pay the $400/yr ransom..they could have given us a grace period considering the fallout..
    Is it really $400 a year? That's terrible. The fee for removing the ads was about $2 a month, and it seems they left those accounts alone.
    They clearly should see a backlash with people migrating en masse and their image being tarnished.

  19. #39
    Moderator Syrte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seiji View Post
    Hi Syrte, I will make time when I have less to do and fix this or make an updated thread on Karafu watches. If some French forum guy wants to take my material and re-publish material it as if it is his discovery, well the Internet is the Wild West and it's gonna be pretty hard to do anything about it. It's too bad, I can't say I haven't paraphrased some information I have read so I am not entirely innocent myself. But, at least I try to link where I got the info Someone did that with my 13e RDP information as well and was damn proud of it as well. Eventually someone relinks the original so maybe justice finds its way.
    Thanks Seiji, I'm unsure where the French guy has found the info, not sure whether he took it from you.

    He mentions without naming him an American collector who had queried Longines directly and Longines had replied something to the effect they only knew of one such chronograph they delivered directly (IIRC- I might be a bit off).

    The guy is not just anyone, he is the founder of the largest French forum and the author of the leading book just published about Zenith, after 10 years of work. So it's totally possible he did his own homework.
    However, and unfortunately, good academic/ journalistic practices of citing sources or crediting others for their research doesn't seem to be very prevalent on watch forums.

    What's strange is that I remember you posting recently about wanting to donate this watch to the Seiko museum-- but I I could not find that thread when I searched with the words longines seiko and museum.
    Did I
    Miss something?
    Last edited by Syrte; 07-17-2017 at 14:53.

  20. #40
    Senior Member Seiji's Avatar
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    Well, I guess the good news is that there is at least one other person that has checked into Karafu Longines/Hattori chronographs and knows they are on the rare and historically interesting side I don't mind that so much as the other person that took all the credit for the discovery of 13e RDP watches and posted my pictures and data under his name. That was a bit too much for me.

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